Virtual Thermometer

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radium98
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Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:07 am

Short description:
Measures and writes the temperature from a COM port into a text file.
Guys i am trying to build this , after many failes projects before , and where with atmel2313 and ds18b20 wich all not work , and even one with 16f628a .
now i get this circuit , and my problem that , i could not find this bss138 wich is a logic shift lifter .My question wich close transistor could take place or work ? that i can find other then 2n7000/7002 wich were fake also .
can i try to use bs170 ?
and if anyone suggest a circuit with lm35 or this ds18b20 that interface an rs232 port and log the temperature with txt file via com port .
thanks . :whistle
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thewisepranker
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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by thewisepranker » Tue Jun 04, 2024 11:41 am

This might be an XY problem. What are you actually trying to do? What's the bigger picture?

radium98
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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Tue Jun 04, 2024 4:11 pm

@thewisepranker it is not from any software , just this picture is from the download section from airomate software rds . i need something that work with pic or avr that log the temperature filevia com port rs232 and work with lm35 or ds18b20 . Anything not clear .

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Tue Jun 04, 2024 4:50 pm

Thermometer.jpg
for what i did before is this , i have read the output via terminal . but i am not seeing any temperature with and without the sensor , same output i have .Is there anything wrong with this circuit that is missed ?
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thewisepranker
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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by thewisepranker » Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:55 pm

That's not quite what I meant - what's the end goal of this? Are you trying to measure the temperature of something during a test, are you trying to learn about RS232, are you testing some DS18S20 modules, or what?

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by King Croccy » Tue Jun 04, 2024 8:22 pm

I think that circuit (above) is an add on circuit for the Monrds encoder. I'm not 100% but I think it is supposed to allow the "indoor" and "outdoor" temperature to be displayed over RDS. I suppose in hot countries it would be quite good but in UK (where the weather is always :poo :poo ) no one really cares lol

Here's an idea that I had a while back when I saw this circuit, it might be more useful for measuring the ambient temperature and also the rigs power amplifier heatsink temperature (with live readout via rds)?! :tup

Can anyone clarify, would this need for a pc to be permanently connected to the encoder for this to work or is possible to display temperature without it?

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Thu Jun 06, 2024 5:48 am

@King Croccy you have really a good memory , i like that .But i just want to see how it work and display the temperature in my home 3w transmitter .But it is a good idea to put an rds inside a big rig , not in my situation , and see it temperature monitoring , via radio receiver :)
Yes it must be a pc connected , then how it must send the data to eeprom and then decoded from txt by the software . i should ask again can i replace bss138 by what , and if bs170 work here , and in the attiny schematic , does it seem to have anything wrong in theinternal connections (something missed ) because with or without the sensor on pin 11/12 same result at the terminal output .
thank you .

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by thewisepranker » Thu Jun 06, 2024 5:25 pm

I originally started writing a long-winded post about how to figure out for yourself whether the BS170 would be a suitable replacement for the BSS138 but I changed my mind because I'm struggling to make sense of the story, which meant I couldn't be bothered. Looks like I'm doing it now anyway.

Why not just buy a cheap off-the-shelf module like this? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/276393247293

How do you know your 2N700Xs are counterfeit? What happens when you've got one in-circuit? Please don't just say "they don't work". Have you tested one separately, out of the circuit?
I don't see it as a very likely candidate for counterfeiting. A counterfeit transistor requires a donor, and the requirements are - cheap, available in very high quantities, usually of the correct channel (in this case N-channel) and matching the package of a much more valuable transistor. In this case, what donor transistor would you use to be able to make a return by the time the re-marking has been done? I can buy genuine 2N7002s for as little as 1p each at quantity from Mouser as an individual (as opposed to a buyer in the supply chain for a large company that makes lots of electronics). Where's the market? Packs of five for tens of pence each on eBay in dribs and drabs to hobbyists?

The BSS138 is readily available:
https://www.mouser.co.uk/ProductDetail/ ... 4arg%3D%3D almost 800k in stock
https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/d ... 138/244210 162k in stock
https://uk.farnell.com/onsemi/bss138/mo ... dp/9845330 500k in stock
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/mosfets/6710324 1.7k in stock

The BSS138 isn't a level shifter, it's an N-channel MOSFET.

Rather than just tell you whether the BS170 can replace the BSS138, I thought it'd be more useful to show you how to figure it out for yourself. You will need to know the following:
- Channel required (P or N)
- Max drain-source voltage applied when not conducting
- Max drain current when conducting
- Gate drive voltage available to ensure saturation

This will allow you to filter results on an electronics website like Mouser or Digi-Key etc. From this you can notionally choose a FET and with the datasheet you can calculate:
- Power dissipation as a result of the drain-source resistance
- Worst-case junction temperature factoring in the max ambient temperature expected
- Max gate voltage applied

Then you will check:
- Max drain-source voltage rating is not exceeded
- Max drain current rating is not exceeded
- Max gate voltage rating is not exceeded
- Power dissipation rating is not exceeded
- Junction temperature rating is not exceeded
All ideally with some margin.

If all of those are within specifications then it's a suitable replacement/alternative.

Don't just compare the datasheets as you're assuming whoever designed that circuit chose a suitable transistor (the BSS138) in the first place.

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Thu Jun 06, 2024 8:31 pm

i should first thank you for this long writibg , and helping , but where i am in , i can tell you that we only have an gouvernement electricity of 6/24 a day Only , and all the market is fulfill of fake replacement , one of the lm35 was an npn transistor and burnt my hand with , one of the ds18b20 was a thyristor according to an avr tester of components , wich the working one gives another specs , what i would said is that a freind to me bought the bs170 and i am with my luck this time to test them :) . i wish i can buye from external source , and i would like to do this for fun .then if it is only working as switching i would see if it work .But why the first scheme does not work ? do there a missing wiring for the attiny ?

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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by EFR » Fri Jun 07, 2024 6:32 pm

I once bought Vishay branded IRF530 fets from a big national dealer here, all of them where npn transistors. Next batch was some random fets as IR made ones.

I also once bought bag of D18S20 sensors, everyone had same ID.

There is no fakes in UK market?
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Re: Virtual Thermometer

Post by radium98 » Sat Jun 08, 2024 7:15 am

In fact yes , very reputable these days . So why old is gold .And original will have copies .

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